40 ft ferrocement sailboat

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Buying a Ferro Cement Boat

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Condition is not the only concern There is a very nice ferro-cement 40' in our club that has been for sale for a couple of years for a good price. It is owned by an older couple (he is close to 80 I think) who keep very good care of the boat. Several people have wanted to buy the boat but backed off because they could not get insurance coverage. It is a shame because it is a lot of boat for the money.  

I've considered ferrocement boats in the past, and insurance is an issue, mainly because most surveyors won't or can't give a good hull survey. That boat appears to be in good shape, but I've seen it on craigslist before and as I recall he's asking too much for it; somewhere around 20K and the engine needs machine shop work? I don't know...  

I have heard it said that that only one in ten ferros are worth owing, but that one will likely outlive the owner and will be the best boat bargain going. I looked briefly at them for world cruising as a couple of authors I like have had them. But in the end I realized that the skill of the builders of ferros in the '70s and '80s was too dodgy and irregular to risk not only my boat kitty, but my safety. Good luck, but the fact is that I see more ferros being jackhammered into rubble these days than I've ever seen on the water.  

Try here for info and links to ferro owners and builders: http://cruisingresources.com/Ferrocement_Construction  

Don't fall in love with the first boat you find. Here are some 1970s 40 foot boats recently from eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1973...0QQihZ008QQcategoryZ63731QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Didn't sell at $6500 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/40-A...2QQihZ013QQcategoryZ63731QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Sold for $10K http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Morg...3QQihZ002QQcategoryZ63731QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Sold for $12.6K http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1986...7QQihZ013QQcategoryZ63731QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Didn't sell at $12K If beam is 12 feet or under you can get a boat trucked to you for about $3 per mile. (Wider costs more.) There are lots of projects out there. Don't pay too much for yours. A fiberglass boat as a few advantages over ferrocement. They're much lighter, so they're more fun to sail. They're lighter so you use smaller sails, rigging, winches, etc., for a given size of boat. Surveyors can inspect them so insurance companies can write you a policy. And, when you're done with it, there's a much bigger pool of potential buyers out there. Have fun, Tim  

Not many surveyors have a good background in ferrocement construction, and many can not adequately survey a ferro boat. Insurance is a problem, especially with the home-built ones. Also, maintenance is higher from what I have seen...and any moisture ingress into the hull will cause the steel wire or mesh to corrode, which causes it to expand, and damage the surrounding cement.  

Personally - I like the good ones a lot, but there are unique issues associated with owning one. Insurance, survey, repair, finishing, grounding... If you get lucky and find a sound hull, you will get the strongest, most durable craft around. Determining whether or not it's a sound hull is so expensive that you can probably find something comparable in GRP for the same outlay. Re-sale will be a big problem. If there was a decent market for them - Hartley and Samson would still be building them. http://www.ferrocement.org/  

Altair Hello, I am the owner of the boat mentioned at the start of this thread. PM me should you wish further details. Edited/Cam  

It has been writen in a lot of cruising articals that when entering a distant exotic location the writer was surprised by the large number of ferro boats . Insurance is not a big issue as many cruisers do not have full insurance. Good luck and enjoy your ferro boat.  

Nicolas..advertising one's boat within the forum is not permitted. I have edited your post accordingly. Anyone who is interested can PM you for details. Good luck!  

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ferro-Cement-good or bad

• Thread starter GRBWork
• Start date Jun 23, 2004
• Forums for All Owners
• Ask All Sailors

i am looking at used boats and boy the ferro cement jobs are a bargain. Are they any good? can you resell them 5 years down the road? I want to spend about $60k for a used sailboat in the 40' range to go up to Alaska from Portland in the summers. Any suggestions? I have only owned small daysailers so I am somewhat uniformed.  

Strong Hulls The Ferro Cement boats that are still around are very good bargins. Cement that is in the water becomes stronger. If there are no signs of visable rust the hull was built very well. The bad hulls are long gone. Some WW 2 landing craft were made of ferro cement and they are still around and in good shape.  

Ferro-Cement Ferro-Cement boats are generally “cheap” for good reasons. They don’t generally sell well (low price & few buyers). Mostly built by amateurs, there are numerous ways to "go wrong" in building ferro-cement. Unless you REALLY know what you’re doing, they are to be avoided like the plague. If you were really expert you wouldn’t be asking. That said, there are some good bargains to be had on decent cement boats.OMHOGord  

Another opinion From Jeff_H on “Sailnet”(This is from a previous discussion of Ferrocement)My take on ferro-cement is that it is, in fact, pound for pound the weakest of all of the commonly used boat building materials. Ferro-cement operates by the same principle as fiberglass, in other words, a high tensile strength reinforcing held by a high compressive strength, low tensile strength cement. The cement in ferro-cement ideally is a high strength Portland cement. The cement in fiberglass is polyester, vinylester or epoxy resin. The tensile reinforcing material in ferro-cement is steel (sometimes with glass fiber, and in fiberglass its glass in a variety of forms, kevlar, carbon and all kinds of new variations on these materials.Ferro-cement's weight comes from a number of sources. First of all, no matter how small the boat, there is a practical limit to how thin ferro-cement can be. Ferro-cement needs to have a minimum thickness in order to have sufficient depth of material to protect the reinforcement from moisture. Because of this boats below 40 to 45 feet are generally considered too small to use ferro-cement efficiently. (i.e. they weigh more than they would in some other material.)The implication of the weight issue is not readily obvious. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, Weight in and of itself does nothing good for a boat. It does not make it stronger, or more comfortable or more stabile. Weight does increase the stress on the various parts of a boat. It increases the size of a sail plan required to achieve a particular speed. It increases drag and typically means that for a given draft a boat will have a less efficient keel (i.e trading off greater drag for the same amount of leeway.)In order to carry more sail area the boat needs greater form stability, which comes at the price or a choppier motion and greater drag, or greater ballast or deeper ballast which adds more weight and drag and perhaps depth.To keep the weight down, many ferro-cement cement boats have reduced ballast ratios when compared to other construction techniques. This means that they need more sail area because of their weight but they can't carry more sail area because of reduced ballast ratios without using lower aspect rigs which are by their very nature less efficient.This is further complicated by the fact a higher proportion of the weight in a ferro-cement boat is carried in the in the topsides (and sometimes decks). This means a high center of gravity which has a variety of implications; reduced stability, wider roll angles, smaller angles of ultimate stability, and more prone to excitation rolling (which may be slightly offset by the greater inertial moments due to weight).Then there is maintenance costs. In a study performed some years back looking at the life costs of various materials, ferro-cement-cement came out as the highest maintenance cost material (if I remember worst to best was ferro-cement, steel, conventional wood, aluminum, fiberglass, cold molded wood) Of course as with any generalized study there will be case by case exceptions and given the comparatively small sampling of non-FRP boats it can be easily skewed by a few bad apples.Other problems with ferro-cement are the difficulty of connecting things to it, and prevention of rot in wood in contact with ferro-cement. The difficulty in bolting to ferro-cement is that ferro-cement hates localized loadings. It’s hard to glue things to ferro-cement. secondary bonds are greatly weaker than primary bonds.Then there is the market value thing. ferro-cement does have a reputation in the States that does not match the comparatively high regard that it is held in other countries. Some of this is just plain unfair prejudice but some of this comes from real shortcomings in the materials as noted above. A well-built ferro-cement boat can be a good cruising boat. But the image of the crudely finished ‘hippie’ built cement and rust buckets still clouds the perception of ferro-cement for many North Americans.The other problem is telling whether the boat that you are looking at is a good boat. It is very hard to do non- destructive survey techniques to tell whether the original work was done well and is in good condition. While sounding will reveal any major separations in the cement to reinforcing bond, it does little to determine the affects of fatigue, poor curing practices or cold joints. With Ferro-cement it is particularly important to maintain the ferro-cement parts in good condition. That can be very significant. People who buy boats because they are priced well below the market, often are overly frugal or just plain do not have the money that it takes to properly maintain a boat. An otherwise good Ferro-cement boat left to poor maintenance and miss-handling can quickly become a poster child for why North American’s don’t trust Ferro-cementTo me the real cost of owning a boat is the difference between what you paid for the boat, the cost of upgrades and maintenance and the price that you can get when you sell the boat. The problem with a lot of low value boats is that the sales price is always limited no matter how much you put into the boat. This too works against ferro cement boats.I guess my conclusion is if you are strictly looking for an initial up front cost boat and don't mind putting some sweat equity in, and you can look past the sailing shortcomings, and you actually find one that was well built and well maintained, a ferro-cement boat might work out fine for you. For most of us, they do not.RespectfullyJeff  

Gord,... I am not familiar with 'cold molded wood'. What is it?  

Acid and Cement Problem I know of a boat in Seattle a few years ago that sank at the dock at least three times due to battery acid eating holes in the hull.  

Cold Molded Wood DALE:Cold Molding Wood is the practice of building up a hull shell or any other structure using multiple layers of thin, vertical grain wood veneers over an open framework, male building mold - without using steam. The result of this process can be thought of as very high quality, custom shaped marine plywood. See the excellent book “The Gougeon Brothers on Boat Construction” (#002).  

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Search our catalog, go direct, enter a boat reference, ferro cement 40ft ketch, £ 0 sold / unavailable.

• Boat REF#  ·  220214
• Length  ·  12.27m
• Year  ·  1974
• Construction  ·  Ferro Cement
• Underwater profile  ·  Long Keel
• Sleeping berths  ·  8
• Engine  ·  1 x diesel 28hp, Volvo Penta MD2040 ()
• Lying  ·  Medway

Boatshed Medway

This boat is off the market but here are some boats that are still for sale.

• Specification
• Additional Information

Extra Details

Reconditioned Volvo penta engine fitted approxmately 4 years ago with only 160 hours.

Ketch rigged Aluminium spars () with Stainless Steel standing rigging ()

Electrical Systems

12 volt battery, 3 batteries charged by: engine, wind generator, solar panels, shore power

Construction

The hull on this yacht has been built in an approved, proven method for Ferro-Cement construction, as confirmed by the Lloyds register of shipping Ferro-Cement Hull release note, No.LON 401584, dated 10th October 1974, signed by E.R Theobald, surveyor to Lloyds Register of shipping and further confirmed by discussions with the designer, who confirmed the scantlings used to construct the hull armature of the yacht.

-Hull copper coated 2009

Accommodation

2 burner propane Stove

2 sheet winches Manual windlass 2 anchors (CQR) 40.00m of chain Aries windvane self-steering system Eurovinil dinghy () (Inflatable) 0hp outboard, Mariner, Short shaft ()

Nav Equipment

Cockpit- Clipper Depth sounder Raytheon speed

Nav Station- New Garmin GPS 158i New A.I.S / Sart Radar New Navtex Cobra marine VHF DSC Radio JRC Lcd Radar 1500 Mk11

Safety Equipment

4 bilge pumps (2 manual / 2 electric)

Broker's Comments

These boat details are subject to contract. If your looking for a blue water cruiser or even a live aboard, this could be the boat for you. Just look at her spec and amount of accommodation space. She was designed by Christ Petre to be both rugged and attractive, She smells good, feels very homely and there is ample storage too. This is a very solid and robust yet elegant lady. A real eye-catcher when under sail, if you want to go round the world this appears to be a sea worthy blue water cruiser that will and has done just that! And at a great price this is a must see. Viewings highly recommended. Note: Offers on the asking price may be considered.

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NEW LISTING: NORDHAVN 40 ‘TEN BEARS’

All listings, nordhavn 40 "ten bears".

“Ten Bears” is hull #40, well into the Nordhavn 40 series – perhaps the most capable 40-foot passage making powerboat ever designed — and has the well-proven Nordhavn dry stack exhaust system and gravity feed fuel system, producing one of the most reliable engine systems fitted on any yacht. Enter the salon through a Diamond Seaglaze door. There is a dinette settee and table to starboard with an L-shaped seating to port. The galley has light Corian countertops, and is located to port at the forward end of the salon. The TV and audio-visual equipment are to starboard. Just forward there are steps up to the pilothouse and down the passageway is access to the head and sleeping cabins. The head, with separate stall shower is to starboard, and the guest stateroom is to port. Engine room access is through the guest cabin. At the forward end of the passageway is the owners’ stateroom with a centerline double bed, and a lot of stowage space organized in hanging and overhead lockers port and starboard. The engine room of the Nordhavn 40 is highly regarded for its space and systems organization. A mishap that resulted in a sinking, caused by down flooding, without any structural breaches or failures, occurred in 2004 and resulted in many of the major components being replaced in time since. In the last 20 years following this event, “Ten Bears “has logged over 20,000 miles.

Specifications

• Six (6) ea. Diamond/Seaglaze opening windows with insect screens  
• Cell shades on all salon windows  
• Carpet on sole  
• A large teak dinette table to starboard with protective cover  
• Cream colored Ultra-leather on salon seating  
• Custom ottoman with Ultra-leather  
• Double stainless steel sink
• Moen faucet with removable crane/sprayer
• Princess 3-burner stove and oven (two/2 ea. 20 lb. propane tanks are stowed in a cockpit locker) – new in 2013
• Goldstar microwave oven
• Krusher trash compactor
• Vitrifrigo dual drawer refrigerator – new in 2013
• Vitrifrigo dual drawer freezer – new in 2013
• Lonseal flooring
• Overhead storage lockers
• 12-volt DC outlet
• Settee with dinette table
• Pilothouse watch berth
• Side doors are split “Dutch-door” type
• Plastimo overhead steering compass
• Chelsea clock and barometer
• Added lift kit on pilothouse bench seating for improved visibility and storage – new in 2021
• Remote windlass control
• Remote Carlisle-Finch spotlight control
• Defogging fans integrated with the Espar hydronic heating system
• Crown LTD steering leaning post – new in 2018
• Centerline bed with gas springs for access to stowage space beneath  
• Custom mattress by Seattle Mattress Company  
• Hanging lockers, port and starboard  
• Overhead hatch  
• Opening ports, port and starboard  
• Custom fit quilted bed spread – new in 2018  
• Hanging lockers fitted with heat loop from diesel heater  
• Maretron DSM 410 display for access to critical vessel data  
• Corian counter top  
• Tecma electric head – new in 2012  
• Fiberglass shower stall  
• Clear glass shower door  
• Locker storage over vanity  
• Main Engine (3,675 hrs.)  – Lugger 668D, 105 hp, continuous-duty rating, w/ Twin Disc 3.9:1 transmission and 2″ propeller shaft
• Main engine freshwater coolant pump – new in 2024
• Installed trolling valve on transmission – new in 2022
• Main engine alternators – 1 ea. 130-amp for house bank charging, and 1 ea. 40-amp for engine start battery charging
• Multi-stage alternator voltage regulator – new in 2014
• Victron BMV 712 Smart battery monitor – new in 2018
• Spurs line cutter on main shaft
• Propeller removed and scanned to “Class 1” in 2007
• Wing engine – Yanmar 3GM 30 w/ 1″ propeller shaft and Martec folding propeller – providing a redundant propulsion system rather than having a second source of propulsion linked to the main shaft (new in 2010 – 55 hrs.)
• Stainless exhaust mixing elbow for wing engine – new in 2018
• Two (2) ea. 460 US gallon vinylester resin-laminated fiberglass fuel tanks (920 gals. total).  Extremely durable.  Each tank has a sight gauge and a man hole size access port in the top.
• Tanks inspected and cleaned in 2013
• Tank access hatches rebuilt in 2013
• Centerline supply tank, gravity fed through 3/4″ fuel lines from the main tanks.  All systems requiring diesel fuel are fed from this tank. The large diameter fuel supply line reduces the chance of debris in the fuel ever causing a blockage.
• There is a water drain fitting at the low point in the tank.
• Dry stack exhaust with keel cooler eliminates raw water pump and raw water contact with engine. Main engine exhausts well above deck in moving air.  No intake through-hull to ingest debris into cooling system. Replaced by Hatton Marine in 2013.
• Isolated wing engine fuel tank (replaced in 2010) – 10-gallon tank is independent from the main fuel system. Fuel is filtered through a separate Racor filter during operator-selected refueling of the wing engine tank from the main supply.
• Racor duplex 900 fuel filters with vacuum gauge for main engine – new in 2014
• Fuel transfer system with in-line Racor 900 filter
• Reverso oil-changing system – plumbed to main and generator engines
• Fuel flow meters on main engine and generator – new in 2018
• Marine Air – 3-zone air-conditioning system.  Two compressors – new in 2013.
• Naiad active fin stabilizer system
• Paravane passive stabilizer system with custom fish holders added to swim step extension
• Custom davit mounted on swimstep to launch combination Paravane fish / flopper stopper roll control
• 8-hp Side-Power bow thruster
• 8-hp Side-Power stern thruster – new in 2009
• Wireless hand-held control for bow and stern thrusters.  Espar hydronic heating system with closet loops for storage locker heat, and hot water heat exchanger for extended hot water – full maintenance and upgrades in 2018.
• Windshield wipers
• Northern Lights 8Kw generator – new in 2005 (1,310 hrs.)
• Two (2) 12-volt 30-amp shore power inlets – one for general service and one for air-conditioning when available
• Victron Multi-Plus 3000 3 KW inverter/charger – new in 2018
• Two (2) engine-driven alternators – 40-amp for engine battery charging, 130-amp for house bank
• An extra bank of four L-16 house batteries totaling 880 amp hours were added in  2021
• Two (2) AGM engine start batteries – new in 2020
• One (1) AGM wing engine/generator start battery – new in 2020
• Eight (8) 6-volt lifeline AGM house bank batteries – new in 2013
• Victron BMV 712 Smart battery monitor – new in 2018
• Two Furuno TZ Touch-2 15″ multifunction displays – new in 2016  
• Additional 12″ TZT display with Fishfinder and transducer –new in 2022  
• CCTV cameras located forward, aft and in engine room  
• Furuno NXT doppler radar – new in 2016  
• Additional new Furuno radar added in 2022  
• Added custom pilothouse dash panels for new electronics installation- new in 2021  
• Furuno Navpilot 711C autopilot controller with pilot computer – new in 2016  
• Auto-pilot extension for cockpit steering- new in 2022  
• Jastram follow-up steering lever – new in 2016  
• Furuno DFF3D sonar – new in 2018  
• Vesper Marine Watchmate Vision 2 AIS class B transponder – new in 2018  
• Milltech Marine AIS / GPS antenna – new in 2016  
• Standard Horizon VLH-3000 loud hailer  
• Starlink mobile antenna – new in 2022  
• Furuno DGPS unit – new in 2022  
• Maretron DSM 410 display for NMEA 2000 data in both pilothouse and forward stateroom – new in 2018  
• Furuno FI 70 color instrument display  
• Maretron NMEA 200 temperature sensor for engine room and stuffing box – new in 2018  
• Maretron RIM 100 with alarm that monitors bilge water – new in 2018  
• Maretron fuel flow meters for main and generator – new in 2018  
• Victron color control GX electric monitor – new in 2017  
• Two digital 16′ VHF antennas – new in 2018  
• Additional Furuno VHF- new in 2022  
• Icom IC-M424 VHF radios  
• Added Predict Wind data hub- new in 2022  
• Added seven receptacles with USB charging option  
• Samsung 23″ LED monitor in owners’ stateroom
• Added DVD player in owners’ stateroom – new in 2022
• Added 27″ TV in salon – new in 2022
• Fusion MS-AV700 marine stereo
• Four (4) ea. Bose speakers in main salon
• Receptacles for dockside TV and telephone on Portuguese bridge, plus internal wiring in boat
• Three (3) ea. water tanks – port and starboard upper tanks (w/ sight gauges) gravity feed to lower tank on centerline
• Sight gauges – new in 2018
• ESPAR diesel boiler hydronic heating – new in 2022
• Spectra Ventura 150 12 volt 6 GPH watermaker
• Watermaker membrane – new in 2020
• Head system – Tecma electric head
• Edson manual bilge pump with 2″ hose, operable from aft end of main salon
• Jabsco bilge pump per Nordhavn specification – new in 2014
• Rule high-water emergency bilge pump – new in 2018
• Hot/cold cockpit shower
• Water heater installed – new in 2014
• Marco UPE12/E Smart variable speed fresh water gear pump – new in 2018
• Secondary Jabsco back-up freshwater pump
• Installed Black water pump – new in 2020
• Trawler mast with electric winches for dinghy launching – new boom winches and Spectra line in 2018 – new blocks, running gear and tuned in 2017
• Added custom swim step extension by Prime Fabrication – new in 2020
• Added custom fish cleaning table that mounts on both aft swim step and port cockpit combing using heavy duty Burnewiin mounts
• Fishing rod holders
• Boom winch controls on boat deck and in cockpit
• Added AB 10’6″ hard bottom inflatable with 20HP Honda outboard – new in 2020
• Weaver deck chocks for dinghy – new in 2018
• Viking Pro 4-person canister life-raft deck mounted in stainless cradle – certified in 2020
• Maxwell 2200 electric anchor windlass – rebuilt in 2024
• 88 lb. Rocna anchor
• 400′ of 3/8″ BBB anchor chain
• Added Rocna stern anchor setup-new in 2020
• 3 “Black Oak” LED light bars added to bow for enhanced night vision – new in 2021
• Added baitwell pump – new in 2023
• Saltwater wash down at bow
• Added sea water direction manifold aft – new in 2023
• Saltwater wash down pump installed aft – new in 2023
• Freshwater washdown on Portuguese bridge, port side
• Hot and cold shower in cockpit
• Diamond/Seaglaze aluminum exterior doors and windows
• Carlisle-Finch searchlight with remote control in pilothouse
• Magma propane barbecue grill with slide-out bracket on transom
• Outland rigid hatch covers – new in 2018
• Bottom painted with black anti-fouling in 2024
• Prop-Speed underwater running gear coated in 2024
• Engine keel cooler removed, flushed, cleaned and re-installed 2024
• Nordhavn owner’s manual and all component manuals
• Quick-line stern line mounted on reel
• Fenders and dock lines
• Spare parts
• Fireboy suppression system with 241 suppressant in engine room
• Life-sling overboard rescue system
• Smoke and carbon monoxide alarm
• Edson manual bilge pump operable from main salon
• Jabsco electric bilge pump
• Two Ultra Safety Senior bilge switch
• EPIRB mounted on boat deck – new in 2020

Listing Broker

Larry Gieselman

Sales representative.

• 949.300.3377
• 949.496.4848
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